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Troops could be in Iraq for half a century

By
May 31, 2007

A vast majority of Americans might want U.S. troops out of Iraq but President George W. Bush wants to keep this country's men and women in uniform in harm's way in that war-torn country for at least 50 years.

Just like Korea.

Although the "official line" from the Bush administration has been that America would not have a "permanent" presence in Iraq, Presidential spokesman Tony Snow admitted Wednesday that current plans accept the fact that "you get to a point in the future where you want it to be a purely support model."

Snow said such a model would be based on "the Korea model…in which the United States provides a security presence, but you've had the development of a successful democracy in South Korea over a period of years and, therefore, the United States is there as a force of stability."

The U.S. has been a "force of stability" in Korea for a half-century and Americans have died over the years in numerous "incidents" along the border between the north and south.

Writes Steve Holland of Reuters:

Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid of Nevada said in a statement he believes it is time for Bush to "recognize the reality on the ground in Iraq," that U.S. troops are mired in an Iraqi civil war and a change in course is urgently needed.

"Democrats know that Americans demand realistic plans, not more White House rhetoric, rosy predictions and best-case scenarios. Our troops and the American people deserve better," Reid said.

Iraq's neighbors have raised concerns about the possibility of the United States maintaining permanent bases in Iraq, and some U.S. lawmakers have said they think the Iraqi insurgency may have been fueled by perceptions the United States wants a permanent presence in the country.

Washington has consistently denied wanting permanent bases in Iraq.

Snow said U.S. bases in Iraq would not necessarily be permanent because they would be there at the invitation of the host government and "the person who has done the invitation has the right to withdraw the invitation."

"I think the point he's (Bush) trying to make is that the situation in Iraq, and indeed, the larger war on terror, are things that are going to take a long time. But it is not always going to require an up-front combat presence," Snow said.

"The president has always said that ultimately you want to be handing primary responsibility off to the Iraqis," he said.

"You provide the so-called over-the-horizon support that is necessary from time to time to come to the assistance of Iraqis but you do not want the United States forever in the front."

21 Responses to Troops could be in Iraq for half a century

  1. long_rider

    May 31, 2007 at 9:07 pm

    Americans do not have a complaint about anything this idot says. We are the ones leaving him in office. We are the ones who are leaving the corrupt politicians in office. Therefore we get what we deserve.

    Most Americans are pathetic, they should be made to go to Iraq and live. Democracy carries a price tag, but most Americans are not willing to help pay it.

    Go for it Mr. chimp president, turn this great nation into what ever you want to, our people don’t care.

    Give our job away, we don’t care.

    Kill our soldiers, we don’t care.

    Create your own constitution, we don’t care.

    Take away our freedoms and rights, we don’t care.

    Do away with our pensions and social security, we don’t care.

    Let big business have what ever they want, we don’t care.

    Don’t ever let anyone talk tou into gun control, we may need those guns to get our contry back from the government.

  2. Carl Nemo

    May 31, 2007 at 5:31 pm

    Great minnie-rant gene! I’m sure the Bushistas have their butts puckered everytime the official hurricane season starts and it’s due soon. Last year was lucky, but I have a feeling the we are going to get hit hard by more multi-billion dollar damaging hurricanes. It’s predicted to be a “tuff” season!

    What irritates me greatly is how poorly managed the Katrina recovery has been; i.e., the corruption, the wastage and general mismanagement, all the while our leaders are pissing hundreds of billions down an Iraqi rathole.

    Btw, doing Ativan is ok because that’s part of another government sponsored boondoggle. Ativan is in the same class of drugs as Valium, Diazepam etc. Compared to Prozac and all the drugs in it’s family, Valium is incredibly benign even when chased with booze. It was referred to as “mothers’ little helper” in the 60’s… :)) But the government frowns upon Valium and its’ associated analogs as being almost the equivalent of “crack cocaine”. No kidding?! If someone asks their doctor for a prescriptipon of Valium they get the uh-oh, we’ve got a “druggie” look. :)) Why so? There’s no money for big-pharm concerning Valium, Diazepam etc. These very calming and quite safe drugs are very cheap in comparison to the newer class of anti-depressants which have many dangerous side effects linked to a track record of associated violence via suicide, publicly inflicted mayhem etc., but that’s were the bucks are for big-pharm. It’s estimated there are 60 million Americans are on this class of anti-depressants at this time. That may also explain why things have gotten so bad with little response from the national peanut gallery. They’ve been chemically lobotomized.

    You’re entitled to your “quite safe” Ativan chased with a shot. You are among kindred spirits on CHB with most if not all knowing we are headed towards a financial black hole sooner than most think. So just remember you are preaching to choir in most cases… ;)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorazepam

    Best regards…
    Carl Nemo **==

  3. gene

    May 31, 2007 at 9:36 pm

    Carl do you realize that those three (3) active brain cells of mine can handle only a limited volume of information at any given time. (Information overload) gives me one hell of a headache, not to say I do not appreciate your focused intelligence and admire you for that ability. Obviously with only 3 brain cells working at any given moment (focused intelligence) is simply a non-issue for (yours truely).

    Yes I know that much of what I say here is “preaching to the choir” especially with individuals such as yourself who comment often.

    But Carl (your comments) do help to maintain my sanity in a very insane world. You are intelligent, knowlegable and able to express this wisdom in a very detailed and informative way that educates humbled mortals such as myself.

    So with my ativan, a good stiff drink and one of (your) comments (my favorite) life just doesn’t get much better for me.

  4. Even Steven Monton

    June 1, 2007 at 1:19 am

    Pathetic…….actually apathetic is more like it.
    A nation of ignorant half-wits.
    Most should have not been allowed to breed……seriously.

    Most shouldn’t be allowed to vote (that is if voting isn’t rigged now).

    The attention span of a goldfish, and the backbone of a jellyfish, that’s your average American.

    Men fought and died in wars so these losers could let it all go to hell?

    God, if only the soldiers of yesterday would have known.

    The bright side?

    It doesn’t take that many people to make a change.

    I’ll say it again….it doesn’t take that many people to make a change.

    A group of directed, educated individuals, with the ability to lead the way.
    Lead the way.
    Leaders (not followers) unlike like the sheeple that sit on their fat ignorant duffs and watch the sewage that spews out of the propaganda box they are so proud of…..complete nonsense that should be insulting to any person with an IQ over 30, and yet they watch it, and even PAY for it….ha ha.

    Everyone wants to be famous…….it (the TV) shaping their views, their opinions, thier truth, their whole world, and life. Sickening.

    Nothing will be done about Iraq, and Americans are getting what they deserve.
    They’ll believe what the news media says because “hey it’s on TV it MUST be true.”

    The saddest part is that earlier generations of Americans gave thier lives, and died in foreign wars, forsaking their families, their lives cut short, so that these modern day wastes of human sperm could sit around and watch American Idol, or Monday Night Football and drink beer, letting their country go to hell.

    Not caring, and unable to comprehend even the most elementary thoughts, void of any critical examination.

    Pathetic…….no apathetic…..no both.

  5. Will Write

    June 1, 2007 at 2:07 pm

    Who is Tony Snow kidding with his invitatiion concept? Remember Shock and Awe? Remember Reichsfuhrer Bremmer and all he did to Iraq? How many politicians in Iraq get assassinated? How many hundreds of thousands of Iraqis have died since the US arrived to liberate them? The current puppet government is weak and useless and lives inside the US fortified Green Zone, which is their sphere of control and influence. The Iraqis don’t want us — and our continued occupation/colonization of Iraq is an additional flashpoint for jihadists and terrorists. One day, if and when the Iraqis do have free elections, you will see the long awaited Islamic Republic of Iraq, which Saddam and the Baathists forestalled. Then, we will receive a very clear disinvitation…as if killing that has now excalated to 100 US soldiers a month hasn’t give us a clue that maybe we’re not wanted. Ony 50 more years of this?

  6. Carl Nemo

    June 5, 2007 at 8:07 pm

    Thanks Gene for the compliment…! It makes me happy that I’m part of your “pick-me-up” routine. I write from both my heart and knowledge base.

    I want to assure those that might be fearful, that I “know” these mattoids will fail, and fail miserably in the end. Why, you may ask? Simply because the bottom line indicates people worldwide don’t like being told what to do nor controlled especially after seeing what free markets and unfettered, benign capitalism can bring in terms of prosperity.

    The mattoids that are at the highest level of world governments still think they are living at the high-water-mark of the nation-state paradigm; i.e., the very nation-state concept they wish to destroy. The world and world markets have left them behind. They want to destroy the world, turning it into their concept of a New World Order, but at the people’s of the world’s expense and as long as they are in control of their world-encompassing tyranny!

    Poster children for this flawed, antediluvian pseudo-intellectual thinking construct; i.e., “real politik” are none other than Henry Kissinger, Zbigniew Brezhenski, Carrol Quigley,”Tragedy and Hope” (deceased) et. al., all “running dog” think tank facilitators for the “republicrats” and Eurocrats; i.e., the NWO crowd! For some reason these quasi-commie/fascist elitists hate the concept of a middle class. It’s the middle class that’s paying the freight for their continuing national/international profligacy. So, to me it’s a bunch of lazy-assed, coffee shop, hang-out, pseudo-intellectual, over-educated types scheming on how to destroy the very barristas that serve them their latte’s…?! :)) I loathe them all!

    I ascribe to Chairman Mao’s solution. I’d put all these lazy-assed, scheming, pseudo-intellectual bureaucrats to work in the fields similar to “Dirty Jobs” as shown on the Discovery Channel, the cable TV series;i.e., then placing the laborers into the government positions with the elitists now to do the “dirty jobs”, rotating them every 3-5 years or so. Possibly they could be re-educated as to the error of their ways; i.e., thinking they are somehow individually better than the rest of humanity; that is, elitism at it’s worst as we now must suffer! My narrative probably would scare the crap out of an oldline “Chinese Red Commie” because they have become the very essence of all that is bad about capitalism; i.e., effete, lazy-assed, money-hungry, “pirate capitalist” elitists… :)) In my book, elitism is the ultimate flaw in human psychology and is key to our downfall, simply the thought/s that somehow I’m better than you or anyone else around me. I loathe elitists! We “all” need to get our hands dirty in the business of life in order to bond with each other and creation itself!

    Carl Nemo **==

  7. bryan mcclellan

    May 31, 2007 at 8:52 am

    Stupid ass stupidity,Over the horizon? What host government? The iraqi’s have already told us to get the hell out as evidenced by the civil war that is raging right now. I served with R.O.K marines, they had that look in their eyes that told me they were serious about freedom.Thats why South Korea has survived.The people had the will to be free. I served with A.R.V.N.’s, never saw one I would trust not to run. These arab bastards have no regard for individual rights and don’t deserve the patriotic blood that has been spilled on their account. Look at the manner in which they treat the female population if you need proof of what I’m saying.Nothing will change the despicable behavior of these people just as all we did in R.V.N. didn’t bear fruit.. You cannot give a people backbone by fighting their battles for them.

  8. Steve Horn

    May 31, 2007 at 10:30 am

    Bryan –

    I’ve heard the same about ARVN’s from a couple friends of mine who were Marines serving in Vietnam – remarkable how some of “my” scouts (young men who were Boy Scouts in my troop, two of who have served (actually, one is on his second tour, the elder on his third) who’ve returned from Iraq echo the comments in regard to the “troops” we’re “training” there. Seems they wouldn’t trust ‘em in a poker game – much less a situation where the stakes are far higher.

  9. Jenifer D.

    June 1, 2007 at 12:57 am

    comment. I’m in South Korea as I type this and you’re right; Koreans wanted their freedom and they willingly fought for it. What shrub fails to see is that the Arab culture is an entirely different animal than the Asian culture; Asians adapt and learn new things, most of the Arab world refuses to let go of the old ways due to stupidity, ignorance, and the men’s fear of losing control of their cattle (the women) herd.

    Bushco and PNAC go hand-in-hand on this; world domination through invasion and occupation. The U.S. should have never invaded Iraq. Now look at the mess we’re in. I’m not just talking about my brothers and sisters-in arms’ spilt blood, but, financially and socially as well. War is hell AND DAMN EXPEN$IVE!

  10. Steve Horn

    May 31, 2007 at 9:50 am

    So the Korean model is the one selected for Iraq, eh? Is the administration planning to divide Iraq into two unequal parts, one being supported and supplied by, say, Iran, while we support and supply the “free” section?

    Where will the DMZ be established?

    Seems to be more absurd babbling by an adminstration bent on lowering the bar, on a daily basis, in response to the question “how dumb can you get?”.

    Can’t Bush and his pals search American history for a GOOD idea – just once?

    Peace

    Steve

  11. Donnat

    May 31, 2007 at 11:02 am

    For Bush, Haliburton and ExxonMobil? Imagine what that will do to our recruiting numbers. And something tells me the Iraqis aren’t going to settle down and stop killing our troops even in 50 years. The previous posts were right, we’re dealing with a whole ‘nother kind of population and culture in Iraq.

  12. Ken Hill

    May 31, 2007 at 11:18 am

    The US will absolutely be in Iraq for at least 50 years. We went there to secure oil for Western (read US) interests, protect Israel, and build long term bases for a prolonged US presence. We have built the bases so there is no way we will pack up and leave, and leave the bases for yet another round of looting.

    The US soldiers will eventually get off the streets and remain on the bases, but then re-emerge to put down any attempts to fiddle with “our” oil wells. Is there any other explanation for this war?

  13. almandine

    May 31, 2007 at 1:30 pm

    Right on, right on, right on, right on… who else would protect OUR oil?

  14. oldpcv

    May 31, 2007 at 12:21 pm

    The WAR ON TERROR is “ENDLESS” and as such Iraq will be “OCCUPIED” for ever. The fact that “OUR” oil happens to be under “THIER” sand does present a problem.

  15. Ken Hill

    May 31, 2007 at 12:51 pm

    What a perfect scenario–endless war on terrorism–they’re gonna git ya if you don’t go along with our fear tactics–so–we will remain there forever to “keep the terrorists over there.” Well just so happens there are one or two oil wells we can guard while we fight them terrorists.

    And-we tell the Shiites “we will keep you in power and defend you against those Sunnis that historically held power so long as you agree to let us stay here and defend you. What!!,you want us to leave??? Well then, say so long to your brief tenure in power. But–didn’t that feel good, just to hold those reins for awhile? You could continue to do so, so long as you let us stay here and remain on our bases. Think about it for awhile–we know you will arrive at the correct decision.”

  16. Richard Kanegis

    May 31, 2007 at 1:18 pm

    Richard Kanegis (@aol.com)215-563-2866
    22 S 22 nd St Apt 305 Phila PA 19103

    Bush got it slightly wrong, al Qaeda is planning to keep US troops in Iraq for 500 years if necessary, and have no intention on letting us leave until “God” controls the whole earth.

    Note peace activists beheaded, remember North Vietnam used to praise them, al Qaeda only praises those who claim Israel and or the Jews are to blame for everything.

    To make sure the US spends like crazy until bankrupt. Note people watching or listening on the radio the largest peace demo in England suddenly got their inspiration dashed by a news bulletin of terror bombs at two synagogues and the British consulate in Turkey

    Republican Majority Leader Bill Frist was going to call for bipartisan detention reform, but was cut off the air by a news bulletin. Al Qaeda just posted the beheading of Nick Burg on the Internet. Frist, was in the middle of a grim Congressional report on additional Abu Ghraib photos Congress privately viewed.

    Antiwar organizing on theme that Iraq had nothing to do with fighting terrorism fizzled after bin Laden on the Internet ordered Iraq’s not to vote.

    So if the troops start leaving all al Qaeda has to do is start shooting or bombing to make them stay. If that still won’t work they could always attack the US domestically to prevent America from leaving.

    Of course if the US attacks Iran and the Iranian President calls for attacks in the US, bin Laden could turn this country into a shooting gallery with out risking all the monuments in Mecca that he wants to preserve.

    Anyway, the science of doomsday weapons keeps advancing, in far less than 500 year someone who would rather a lifeless planet rather than one where “God” isn’t totally in charge will get their wish.

  17. Carl Nemo

    May 31, 2007 at 4:49 pm

    The MIC guys are ever-scheming on how to continually bleed this nation white. The annual cost for our presence in the Pacific, mainly in Japan and South Korea is about 15 billion dollars. Japan being a responsible nation pays 70 percent of their fair share for a contribution of 5 billion. So the cost for our Japanese presence is about 2 billion per annum of the 7 billion that’s necessary leaving 13 billion to go down a Korean rathole or wherever else deemed necessary in the Pacific.

    Of course with inflation the costs are ever increasing. So if Bushco is talking about a long term presence in Iraq then we are talking about a trillion plus dollars just to play supercop in Iraq for 50 years. With inflation we might be talking quadruple that amount.

    We’re broke as a nation at this point in time and hyper-inflation is beginning to rear it’s ugly head in the wholesale/supply sector with weekly price changes in what vendors charge retailers for goods and these are not oil-based products either. When contractors and service providers are squeezed in this fashion, they cannot contract nor guarantee their pricing or bid for any length of time because they’l be destroyed by having to absorb the increases.

    So if the MIC gets the US involved with a long term presence to protect what seems to be “their” oil from a MIC/”oil patch” viewpoint then “we the people” are in even deeper trouble. The MIC is like a multi-headed hydra that breathes fire, beating it’s tail on the ground and seeking constantly for new ways to consume our money; i.e., money we do not have, so it’s nothing but more Federal Reserve sponsored “debt-money”; i.e., debt that can never be paid off due to the compound interest effect.
    In fact eventually as this situation gets worse a major portion of this nation’s annual budget will simply be to pay the interest on the debt with little left over for “we the people”… :|

    You’d think international bankers would operate in a more responsible fashion. Yes they’re crooks and own everything in view that’s worth anything but why would they want world-based fiat currencies that are ever-shrinking; i.e., imploding in value. A good recession/depression now and then gets things back in order. In fact in a fiat money environment the aforementioned crises is an excellent way to restore value to currencies and to shake out excesses in the capital markets consequences be damned. I’m beginning to think many of these bankers got their MBA’s or whatever credentials they have via a cheap-butt correspondence course… :))

    I’m also surprised the U.S. Treasury sponsored bond market hasn’t collapsed by now. With puny 5 percent returns against true inflation they actually have a negative long-term yield. The government is lying about inflation and has doctored how the CPI is calculated. My estimates indicate that core inflation is running in the 10 percent per annum range or more against all goods and service and not simply select “feelgood” one’s relative to the suppliers of this useless data.

    What stuns me the most concerning Iraq since our invasion is no one talks about how we are going “pay” for our constant meddling on a worldwide basis. The U.S. Government is operating over 700 plus bases worldwide. I guess all we can say about the U.S. at this point in history is our country is nation of meddlers and busy-bodies trying to puppeteer the entire planet. It’s not working, but the MIC doesn’t care because they get paid no matter what, results be damned…!

    I posted a Year 2000 report concerning our byzantine mission in Korea. As you read the report you begin to laugh at the numbers, the projections etc., especially North Korea’s capabilities. The average North Korean has about a one day supply of food; i.e., whatever rat meat and rice they’ve managed to scrounge for the day. I know guys that write this type of material for the government and all I can say it’s “loony toon” prognostication at it’s best.

    Carl Nemo **==

    http://www.iht.com/articles/1996/04/13/pacific.t.php
    http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep2000/korea09122000.html

  18. Jenifer D.

    June 1, 2007 at 1:06 am

    Carl, you know the one consolation I can offer is that most of these MIC hacks won’t be around in 50 years to see the fruits of their treachery to the U.S. and the international community in general. I doubt hell will have satellite television by then either.

  19. Steve Horn

    May 31, 2007 at 2:23 pm

    Finance is how we “won” the cold war with the soviet union – seems the “terrorists” have learned from OUR history (sad that our leaders don’t study history, even those (like GW) who were history majors in college!).

    Coincidence, perhaps, that our government, under the current administration, is adopting ever more draconian measures to be used against the citizens (much as the soviet union did)??? I think not.

    What Bush and his pals may have noticed is that, following the fall of the soviet union, there was a financial free-for-all with the decentralization of the state industrial holdings – perhaps their plan is (assuming they can even think this far ahead) –

    1) take total control of the US
    2) break us financially – make us wage sluts to India and China
    3) rape the nation for all it’s worth for a couple of decades
    4) have the totalitarian regime “fail” (scripted, naturally, so there’s no “regal” blood shed)
    5) have those with the resources (carefully accumulated and stashed offshore) buy the remaining industrial resources of the US for pennies on the dollar
    6) impose a Russian style “democracy” where folks like Putin determine who lives, dies, eats, sleeps.
    7) get lots of foreign aid from China and India to “help” this fledgling republic back on its feet …

    Sheer genius … (lawdy I hope massa Bush don’t read this!)

    Steve

  20. Carl Nemo

    May 31, 2007 at 5:05 pm

    Yo Steve, I think you’re the genius for “think-tanking” that scheme up. That may be their plan, but if not you’ve just given them “food for thought”.:)) You’ve outlined a truly great collection of scenarios and it makes sense. In the end all the nations of earth are nothing but part of corporate enterpise zones, with “pirate capitalism” in place with all the governments pretending to be democracies are in actuality a “pink-gloved” Commie/Fascist hybrid! The reps that go to the collective world-wide capitals are nothing but an extended family of apparatchiks performing in a politburo-like fashion for the shadowy oligarchs that call the shots. Basically it’s Orwell’s 1984 societal control paradigm come to fruition, with the tech spin found in Huxely’s “It’s a Brave New World”.

    Carl Nemo **==

  21. gene

    May 31, 2007 at 3:31 pm

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH (laughing)…as though this nation has 50 years left, shit we will be lucky if we make it through the next 5 years. At this point I will settle on just 5 months since I live on the Gulf Coast. Hurricane season, Oh the joys of life on planet earth. Needless to say whats left of this “f**k up nation” will evaporate if one of those bad boys or girl (name dependent) hits those oil rigs and refineries.

    Currently just living day to day (I’m retired thank God) is/has become a real joy. When the shit really does (finally) hit the proverbial fan we ALL will be dead or living in the proverbial HELL.

    OOPS!!! its ativan time and what goes best with ativan……a good stiff drink….why not, I’m 60 and retired.