Winning the War in Iraq???

Oh dear, I woke up this morning reading the news items on the CHB home page.  It was nothing more than partisan street fights. 

Speaker Pelosi returned from her Middle Eastern trip facing all kinds of criticism from Vice President Dick Cheney and other Republicans who claim she may have hurt America’s chances of winning the war in Iraq. 

Almost daily I want to run screaming asking everyone what it means to win the war in Iraq.

Many Conservatives that I communicate with on my own network of addresses tell me that they want to see the end of Islam in the Middle East.  I’ve been told that Islam outnumbers us (whatever “us” is, or are) and it would mean a world war encompassing 80% of the nations on the planet.  Another viewpoint is that the Middle East must be introduced (read “forced”) into a Democracy, which often means “mob rule”. 

Is it not possible to leave Iraq to the people involved and let them sort out their own democracy?  It might mean that a civil war will be recognized (versus a civil war not recognized) and the winner takes all.  At this point in time, America seems to have pissed off all sides of the civil war and it is to our advantage to ignore the whole damn thing.

There is more to our action in Iraq than meets the eye.  Is it the oil that we are protecting?  How do we explain this action?

See Article.

Iraq is apparently dealing with Asia as far as their oil resources go.  So let’s go back to why we are still involved in a war where we come out with no advantages.  Not a single member of the White House can explain what a win in Iraq would mean.  I hear a lot of comments like this war is keeping America free from attack.  This is absurd!  The same people pushing this spin are keeping our borders open to any terrorist who wants to strike us from within.  How stupid do they think we are? 

Will it come down to the Republican Party having to protect the legacy of their Republican president?  We saw a similar problem with the Democrats protecting President Clinton, but no American lives were in jeopardy.  The similarity stops right there.  President Clinton enjoyed screwing the ladies and President Bush is screwing the entire American nation. 

Personally, I was never affected by the promiscuity of any of our Presidents but I am affected by the loss of so many American soldiers….and I cannot help but ask why?

I am constantly disappointed in the Republican Party these last years.  They have become so partisan in their actions and threats to become unacceptable to the majority of their own party members.  The agenda that drew millions to the membership has changed to reflect almost the opposite of their meaning.  In 2000 the GOP reached into the barrel of the religious right and traded American individual freedoms for the votes that they would bring.  I’m still confused as who won the battle with the religious right?  They opened up the fight against abortion and gay marriages but lost the election in 2006.  Unless they knock off the social issues they will lose the election in 2008 and they will sit around in a panic and wonder why. 

The battle will be lost on two items:  the war in Iraq and the prohibitions on individual freedoms.  We are now seeing several Republican Groups trying to clean up their losses by claiming to be against the religious right and promoting individual freedoms.  Sorry pals, you are too damn late.  You voted for a President who took America into a war based on lies and false interpretation of facts.  You voted for a President who has shown little respect for our Americans who were destroyed by Katrina.  You voted for a President who has yet to explain one damn thing he has done wrong. 

If the GOP wants to win another election they are going to have to listen to the voters.  We want our troops out of Iraq since our current President has still not learned how to win a war.  We want our corporations to stop leaving America.  We want our borders closed and a return to a sane Immigration policy asking that all people wanting to live in America have a clean police record and health certificates.  It means that the government returns to protecting all of us from a dangerous immigration allowing criminals to have the right of way and to keep control of the new citizens so our State and County Registrars can control who can legally vote. 

Do I believe the Democrats have a better system?  Actually no! 


  1. Sandy,
    You regularly talk about your disappointment with the Republicans of recent times. I have also been very disappointed with them, by an large, because they have moved away from Republican views. Some of my friends have recently been evangelizing about Ron Paul and trying to get all of their friends to register as Republican so as to vote for him in the 2008 Presidential primary. I’ve done some of my own research and so far determined he’s my favorite choice among the Republican Presidential hopefuls, even though he’s pro-birth and pro-“traditional” marriage. What are your opinions about him?


  2. Booman has gone off on a rant this morning : Iraq for beginners ( Booman Tribune). Between his chat and a look at the war game Don Rumsfeld ‘lost’ – I’ve posted a link on my Blogroll to Desert Crossing – the proposition that Iraq is a result of incompetence looks less plausible than the idea that malice and greed were the motivation : plus Bush got to be the ‘War President’ and take away the freedom of the people.

  3. Sandy Price

    But if the Republican Party turns on him as they turned on Goldwater in 1964, he will have no chance. Goldwater was a limited government kind of guy with individual freedoms very much in his sights but Rockefeller started telling everyone that Goldwater was Jewish and that was the end of his campaign.

    The GOP cannot seem to get their agenda straight and it should be no question that they are still working for a Christian Nation. American Values are now found only in the bible and our Constitution has taken some terrible hits since this new agenda was adopted. I will never vote Republican again unless a man of Paul’s character and integrity runs and then I will work full time for his election. I may have to leave here at that time. One thing he is going to have to do is come up with a V.P. who has the charisma that he is missing.

    Sadly the Democrats have not been able to arrange what they want even in theory and they all seem to be working to knock Bush off his pedestal. That won’t do it! They need a strong message around a strong candidate.

    Our future in America will be in the balance in 2008 and we all must work as a team to help our candidates even if we here at CHB disagree who they are.

  4. The Iraq Oil Law.
    If Osama bin Laden himself were to assist in easing the passage of this law we’d see the biggest rehabilitation of a public figure in recorded history, and Osama would seemingly overnight be transformed back into the “freedom fighter” that he was when Reagan intoned his name during a 1985 press conference.

  5. Judy Bodnar

    This war is now, always has been and will forever be about OIL! The world will see how we have won the war only after we have removed our troops from Iraq and find that within 24 hrs there is an all out civil war. This Bush/Cheney OIL war cannot and will not be won because it was based on lies told by two hubris liars who happened to have Congress under their party’s control, and oil on their minds!

  6. Mike

    dollars on credit acting like imperialist pigs and we didn’t even successfully steal Iraq’s oil. All the downside, none of the upside. Total failure.

  7. Sandy Price

    Apparently the Bush Administration was not around when we were fighting in Vietnam. We did not win that war nor could we have had we even tried. Here we go again. We had enough news coverage after 9/11 to take us into Afghanistan. When did we win that one? Does anyone know? Is it not now known that it was a set up to get us into Iraq for the oil?

    The networks fell all over themselves to feed us the propaganda that Bush fed them. Some of us knew from the beginning that Saddam had no interest in terrorizing America. But we were never told that there were no WMDs found in Iraq until Bush was firmly in place for another 4 years.

    Some of us tried to warn the American people that our government was not on the level and we were thrown out of many of our old Conservative sites. I was already out of CHB but I can show you lists of other sites who were emotionally so taken up with Bush’s social issues that losing lives in Iraq didn’t matter. Sadly they still exist and still can ignore the deaths of our soldiers.

    The terrorism sent out to guide American voters has driven the Republican Party out of their minds. Many are threatening Atomic bombs be thrown in Iran, Syria, and Iraq. They are driven by a crusade-like emotion that Islam must be destroyed. Some of my best friends have lost their rational minds over this hatred for Islam.

    Many are Fox fans and have been taken in by the graphics, background music and emotional hysteria that is now all over the networks. The other night I saw Brian Williams on NBC reporting that Americans are under a siege of pollen. Minor chords with drums and crashing timpany announced our possible end during the yearly spring pollenating of our trees.

    They all thrive on war! they thrive on tabloid exposure of our celebrities and they are all boring me silly.

    Are we making use of the internet to communicate with each other? I think here at CHB we are and we must continue to take the headlines and discuss them without spin and partisan nonsense.

    Many other sites have labelled us as liberals, anarchists, and out of step with the government (hell yes!) and they do not recognize our individual broad opinions that do not have to agree with anyone else. I love the debates here with our blogs. We are often very emotional and we should be!

  8. Paolo

    Hi Sandy,

    Well said! The Bushies and their blow-hard media allies (Limbaugh and Hannity et. al.) say we need to have “victory” in Iraq.

    I distinctly remember Limbaugh lambasting Clinton in the 1990’s for not having a “clear definition of victory” in the Balkans civil war. Also, he lambasted Clinton for not having a clear “exit strategy.”

    This was a rare case of Limbaugh being right. However, he refuses to apply his own standards to Bush.

    How do you define “victory” in a “war on terror?”

    In a normal war, victory is defined by the rival government signing surrender documents and agreeing to terms. There is no such thing as a “terrorist government” to sign documents ending the “war on terror.”

    From a tyrant’s point of view, the “war on terror” is a godsend: a war that can literally go on forever! War, as Randolph Bourne put it, is the health of the state.

  9. AustinRanter


    I posted the below in a ReaderRant thread yesterday:

    “As I recall, Bush declared the goals of invading Iraq in order to get Congress to go along with his war plans (we all know most were lies…but).

    1. We went in to search for and destroy WMD’s. (of course there were none).

    2. To apprehend and bring to justice Saddam. We did that…the man is dead, he was hung for his crimes against humanity.

    3. The Iraqi people created their own form of democracy and all voted for their elected officials.

    4. We attempted to do a restoration of the infrastruct. Sadly, it didn’t happen because half of the region was really ticked off at American presence and occupation…so the rest is history.

    MISSION ACCOMPLISHED…now get the hell out!”


  10. Sandy Price

    We have been our own worst enemy in Iraq. One can only try to imagine what went on in Bush’s mind. It came from the neoconservatives in step one of a one world order. This may be the reason Bush 41 did not step in to try to stop him. Once Bush got us in, there was no way for us to get out.

    The next step may be Iran! It will be our destruction if we try it. In trying to make Iraq into a democracy we are destroying our own.

    Austin, if you only knew how hard I tried to keep the people from voting for Bush 43. They literally picked me up and threw me out of Reader Rant. 24 other forums simply declared me as mad as a hatter for not recognizing this wonderful Christian man. People see only what they want to see.

    Love your reply. Thank you

  11. waldemar michalski

    Sandy, in answer to your question, is it the oil we are protecting, I would like to quote Chalmers Johnson where he wrote in his book titled The Sorrows Of Empire:

    “The strongest evidence that oil was a prime motive was the behavior of the American troops in Baghdad after they entered the city on April 9, 2003. They very effectively protected the headquarters of Iraq’s Ministry of Oil but were indifferent to looters who spent two days ransacking the National museum of its priceless antiquities and burning the National Archives and the city’s famed Quranic Library. The same thing happened to the National Museum in Mosul. While the marines defaced some of the world’s most ancient walls at the site of the Sumerian city of Ur, near Nasiriya, the army was already building a permanent garrison at the adjacent Tallil Air base to protect the southern oil fields.”

    I would say actions speak louder than words!

  12. Carl Nemo

    This war that cannot be won! Why…?! Quite simple it’s urban guerrilla warfare grounded in a nation that has extreme internecine, sectarian fighting being waged within a greater context of a foreign nation having invaded their homeland on false pretense. So they not only hate us for our presence, but they also hate each other relative to whom should be calling the shots in post-war Iraq. This is hatred and warfare to the second power…! Our tankheads on the ground in the Iraq evidently flunked War College 101 and have never even read Von Clauswitz, much less learned anything from ground ops in Nam. Our modern war colleges don’t even test their comprehension concerning what’s being presented. They are treated like executives…everybody wins; i.e, passes through the National War College! This whole war is nothing but a MIC, “oil patch” shakedown of the American taxpayer to the 12th of never! Our military leaders best bury their “preppie” noses in “The 36 Strategies” of Ancient Chinese Warfare. The “Sun Tzu” reads like “Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm” compared to the military wisdom contained in “The 36 Strategies”. The answer to their plight lies as a solution to the function of the 36th stategy, considered to the most valueable of all! of Ancient Chinese Warfare.
    I hate to say it folks, but these “pink-weanie” generals and our executive branch leaders; i.e., greedy mattoids we have running this war in the Whitehouse are the proverbial “village idiots”…! Rest assured they have a plan, but it’s imply to screw the American taxpayer. “We the People” are in harms way with these monsters in control! I urge all citizen/patriots regardless of party affiliation to contact their elected reps and demand, de-funding, de-escalation, and re-deployment of our troops from this “faux” war-zone. This war was started on false, “cooked” intelligence. Let it sink in that 3200 of our fellow Americans have lost their lives for nothing and that 25,000 have been injured with 12,000 of them having long-term, life-changing injuries due to this war. This does not include the 100,000 plus Iraqi citizens that have their lives over-turned by this criminal enterprise. We the American taxpayer have been clipped of 500,000 million dollars plus of “debt-money” based on lies. I’ll post the duty link so folks can find out who their reps are.
    I urge all Americans to stand tall and to make an effort to contact their reps asap.
    Fire your “thought-shot” across the bow of dread-naught “Tyranny”…!

  13. waldemar

    Dear Congressman,

    I greatly appreciate the work you are doing with respect to deterring Bush’s illegal war of aggression in Iraq. Today I read that bush wants to talk to the Democrats about funding the war without a time table.

    It would appear that this president does not understand what government by the people and for the people means. The people want nothing more to do with Bush or his illegal war.

    It doesn’t matter in terms of the outcome whether we leave next month or two years from now. The consequences in Iraq will be the same – a blood bath! Bush is guilty of committing the crimes of mass murder and genocide and I pray that some day the world will hold him accountable for these crimes! The fact that America allows this criminal to continue inflicting misery and death on third world countries adds to the disgrace and shame of the United States and its Congressional leaders!

    Pulling out sooner than later, may however save the lives of more of our troops. Leaving later, will save bush’s ego, cost the lives of more US troops and guarantee that the next president is left cleaning up his messes. The longer the United States stays in Iraq the more severe the Blow Back will be to Americans and their overseas interests!

    Please continue in your efforts to curbe the abuses of power this tin-pot despot is inflicting on America and its tattered Constitution.


  14. SEAL

    I spent several years in and around the Middle East before, during, and after Gulf War I. The experiences gives me a pretty fair handle on the mind sets of the different peoples in the region. There are many unresolveable differences but there is one fact upon which they united. They don’t want any foreigners in their lands and will fight to the death to drive them out. Always have and always will.

    In the first invasion Daddy Bush listened to his military. They told him what would happen if they took Saddam out and what would be necessary to control the country. As enticing as the oil was, Bush knew we did not have the capability to secure and stabalize the country to get it. That is why he called off the invasion and left Saddam in power.

    This time our administration is controlled by world order zealots. In their minds, the oil is not the primary reason they invaded and took over the country. For them, the oil is the benefit. They are so blinded by their desire to rule the world that they delude themselves into believing the impossible. They still think they can “win the war” in Iraq. Cheney doesn’t lie, he actually believes the stupid crap he espouses.

    People need to accept the fact that the only way to put an end to the madness is for the democrats to cut off the funds as they are attempting to do now. Lets hope they don’t back down. It is imperative to our survival as a nation that they break the power hold these delusional idots have and return some sanity to America.

  15. Dayahka

    Today an Iraqi leader said something to the effect that Iraq had gone from terrible under Saddam to terrible, mismanaged, incompetent, and destructive under Bush. What more can be said?

  16. gene

    Today on was an article stating 10 more us soldiers killed. Bush, Cheney and all of their butt licking neocon lovers are all responsible but who can bring them to justice except mabe God, if their is one and I strongly believe their is. The damage has been done and continues to mount. Insanity reigns in Wash DC just look at McCain, what a full blown idiot.
    The World Trade center comprised of 3 main buildings was taken down by explosive charges not by those planes. The world woke to 911 which was orchestraed by evil in high places. Fokes their never was and never will be true freedom on this planet until it is set free from this insidious evil that lurks in the dark and now is willing to expose itself to complete its gold of world domination.

  17. Joyce

    I saw a picture in Time magazine that shows why we are doomed in Iraq. The picture was of an Iraqi family, father, mother, 4 children being tatooed in noninvasive ink by an American soldier doing the job he was told to do. The tatoos were to identify people and what region they lived.

    The degradation and humiliation to the family was obvious. The faces of the children, 2 boys and 2 girls, registered fear and anguish as their father was subjected to the tatoos. What is the liklihood that the IDing may have created some terrorists or suicide bombers? We certainly did not create any Iraqi friends of America.

  18. Bruce Stone

    I concur with the sentiments espoused re: the Bush administration, but as a life long Democrat I am beginning to despair that there is any hope from our side either.

    My liberal, Democratic friends, after all, authorized this “war”, the Patriot Act, the Detainee Bill I & II and allowed the Republican Congress to engage in Deep Oversight of the bedrooms and privacy of the Citizenry while ignoring the actions of King George and his court–out of Fear that they would lose their positions.

    Maybe it is time that we all started Shouting Loud and Clear that the 2 party system has been sold to the Military Industrial Complex and Global Business and admit that our government is now not “Of, by and for the people” but “of, by and for the Priveleged classes”.

    As a Liberal and an American Patriot, I’m thinking it’s time for a Political revolution–I’m tired of folks like Leonard Boswell and Joe Lieberman being able to call themselves progressives/liberals/Democrats (or Demo Independents) while supporting Conservative Lies.

    Overthrow the Bush government with Impeachment–then hold an election with only government financing and door to door campaigning…let’s take this country BACK this time.

  19. erika morgan

    I also am wondering lately if this is a time for a resurgence of “WE THE PEOPLE” party, standing for the rights of the sovereign citizen, and a shift from raping nature for corporate gain; to the greater good, of this planet, that all humanity calls home; denying individual rights for the corpatocracy, as though the corporations, were voters. Our government has been hijacked and is more and more resembling the feudal system our forefathers fled from, its time to take Government back or failing that to start over.

  20. It takes a lot of heat to keep America going. As long as people don’t lie to me, I’m perfectly happy and appreciative of partisanship. Heat and light. I wish more Democrats would come to understand the need for both. I have a sign on the back of my car that says: “Republicans Always Return to The Same Vomit”. I have another that says , “Wars Keep Traitor Trash Rich.”

  21. Michael

    I am so tried of hearing we have won or we will win. How long can Bush’s nose grow before it gets longer then the Republicans party has. Lies, Lies, Lies is all we hear. If George Bush said its not happening or it is not going happen, then it wont. Take global warming. Its not true because King George Bush said its not happening. RIGHT????