I'm a big fan of your opinions, for the most part, Bryan. I think what you have to remember is that karma is not only a function of one's beliefs, but also one's personal history. While we may be able to influence (slightly) one's beliefs, we can't change another's history, nor our own. And at some point, a wise person should learn the lesson of Don Quixote and stop fighting windmills.

A more American version is expressed as something about horses and water......

Thats good advice and though the outcome be unintentional on my part it leads me to conclude that if I'm responsible for changing someones thoughts or direction then I become in a sense charged with their behavior.

Treacherous ground to say the least.

Sort of like making bricks without straw maybe?

Thanks friend, I learn anew.

TURBO for PREZ !

But if all the Don Quixote's of the world hang up their spurs and unsaddle their Rocinantes, then where does that leave poor Dulcinea? What progress comes from the absence of the Impossible Dream? How can one be sure of one's reality if one never stretches to reach a windmill or two? Attainment is not the goal:

"This is my quest,
To follow that star,
No matter how hopeless,
No matter how far
. . .
To be willing
To march into Hell
For that Glorious Cause."

It is the destiny of mankind, what seems to be the only true difference between us and other creatures.

Well, 33rd, that's where the WISDOM part comes in. The Hillary Question, paraphrased. Or, as one of the best lyrics ever written (though far too over-played.....)

"Ya' gotta know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em...."